MuscleJunkie
Enthusiast
Has anyone done a Gen IV engine swap into a Gen III? Could this be done (Engine, PCM and ??) Is it worth it? Topic came up in a conversation and it raised my curiosity.
Already working on it, though mine isn't a simple swap, that would be a LOT easier...
Dan what are you doing? My guess is putting it in a Challenger.
Arrow Racing is supposed to come out with a head package for the gen III using the gen IV heads and should put down 580 to the wheels. The package should have been out by now.
Quote from Todd at Arrow Racing:
"The Gen 3 to Gen 4 conversion makes 650 flywheel horsepower. We are just to the point of pricing this kit so it should be available very soon. I think this set up with the 708 camshaft will make a very streetable package with Great reliability and performance."
Dan, what sort of thing are you doing that doesn't make it a simple swap??
I remember reading that supposedly the GEN III Motor is better for mods than the GEN IV. Is this true and why?
Interesting, so just a head and cam swap results in that much of a jump? Or is there more to it?
The SRT engineers at VOI X stated, during their seminar, that the cam-in-cam is only for smooth idle and emmissions and has ZERO performance increase.
Ted
I see the potential, but with copyright laws and such it may be cheaper to invent a new system as compared to trying to copy and recalibrate the CiC one.
Good luck to you in that pursuit however. I do love more power potential, even if it's not in my car,
Ted
Twin DOHC setup with variable controlled intake and exhaust cams along with a pent roof and 4 valves per cylinder, twin GT52s and 600hp per liter. That's a design... Pushrods are over a 100 years old....
Until someone comes up with the $$ to build a Dohc head for this engine it will remain inefficient.
And with a DOHC setup you will keep clear from any copyright infringments....you will be inventing the wheel not re-inventing it.(well sort of)
Direct injection and camless valvetrain for the ones who have more $$ than they know what to do with... Lol
IMO... The Autronic EMS SM4 has a much better controller for VVTi/AVCS/or whatever it's called this week than the motec units. The drawbacks are you have to use a seperate DBW system and CAN system..but it will def control the engine system better...
My .02$
Howard
Ted,
I think you are totally off in left field as to what I am talking about. Who said anything about copying anything? Recabilbrate, sure... but where did you come up with "copying" something?
When people speak to changing cams it's usually a longer duration, more lift cam. I assumed that you were going to copy the cam-in-cam designwith hpcams. sorry. With 5 copyrights and awards for the technology I would assume that Chrylser would be sensitive to alteration.
Sorry about that. I ass u me'd
Ted
There is a thread describing a TT Gen IV build by Underground Racing which leaves the Venom programming in place and uses a supplemental controller. The engine is of course built. The post from TT states that they believe the Venom programming was a plus to the build. So, wouldn't it be more efficient to buy a low mileage, used Gen IV and mod it in a similar fashion? Why use a Gen III and insert a Gen IV motor and also probably have to convert to a Gen IV tranny?
There is a thread describing a TT Gen IV build by Underground Racing which leaves the Venom programming in place and uses a supplemental controller. The engine is of course built. The post from TT states that they believe the Venom programming was a plus to the build.
Dan, what sort of thing are you doing that doesn't make it a simple swap??
I remember reading that supposedly the GEN III Motor is better for mods than the GEN IV. Is this true and why?
Seems as if this thread got a bit sidetracked. Regarding this, anyone know which motor Gen III or Gen IV is better for mods? Reasoning?
I was reading through the SRT Engineer chats last night has there was a mention from them that the GEN IV engine is already a "highly" stressed engine in it's stock form. What sort of impact does this have on those choosing to mod their GEN IV stock cars versus someone choosing to mod their GEN III stock vehicle? Maybe this is why I remember some mention some mention of the possiblility of the GEN III motor being better for mods than the GEN IV?
I was reading through the SRT Engineer chats last night has there was a mention from them that the GEN IV engine is already a "highly" stressed engine in it's stock form. What sort of impact does this have on those choosing to mod their GEN IV stock cars versus someone choosing to mod their GEN III stock vehicle? Maybe this is why I remember some mention some mention of the possiblility of the GEN III motor being better for mods than the GEN IV?
Both Dan and Underground Racing are talking about TTing a built engine. The SRT Engineers less formally stated that it is safe to put the Mopar controller and headers on the Gen IV. Of course, same would be for offroad use only.
I disagree with RTTTD a bit. I believe that the stock SRT 8 engine used in the Challenger and the Charger produces 425 max HP. As such, the max HP per cylinder in the SRT 8 engine is 53.125. The max HP per cylinder in the Gen IV Viper engine is 60. Therefore, the Viper engine is a more stressed piece.