The Biggest Viper Myth: The Viper Handling myth

[Early93Viper]

Why is it that a lot of so called car guys think the Viper is not a good handling car? I hear of the Viper shortcomings in the handling department almost weekly by the uninformed internet post ***** or just the kid walking up to get a look at my car.

Now if you have ever taking your Viper on the track you know this to be a myth. Hell when I go to the track I pass lotus elise’s, NSXs, and other so called “great handling cars” like there towing an anchor ridden by Roseanne Barr. And even most magazines agree saying the Viper has gokart like handling. So why this myth?

 

[VinR1]

inability + lotsa hp + heavy foot = 'bad handling' myth

 

[ASKYOURWIFE]

I have wondered the same thing many m,any many times...

Every review I ever read of the gen 2 Viper said the handling was very good and the car constantly pulled over 1G on the skid pad...


i feel much more confident going around the curves in my 99 rt10 than i did my 2004 C5...

But I also read many of these bad handling post on other forums...

Even about the SRT10 as well. Wich from everything ive ever read is one of the better handling cars out their..

Even with an extra 200 pounds of heft and being 4 tenths and 4 mph slower than the c6z06 through the 1/4 mile...The SRT10 still manages to equal or SURPASS the c6z06's lap times in every review stock for stock....


Oh well let people who will never even sit in one of these cars think what ever they want. I know this car can handle very very well, as well as most other Viper owners.

 

[Bonkers]

The viper is a big car with a very big motor designed for
torque. Its very easy for an outsider to assume that big
displacement + big rear tires = drag strip monster. And
with virtually no presence on the road course (save the
SpeedGT series) the logical conclusion is that the cars
don't handle well enough to compete.

I don't worry about it much - it makes passing on the
outside of a corner that much more rewarding.

 

[Vic]

I for one had no idea just how good a Viper was in the corners, until I went to the track. And I considered myself a car guy! Most critics have absolutely NO idea what they can do, but that never stops people from talking.

Let anyone who doubts, get a ride with a good Viper driver, and he will sh*t his pants at what high limits it has. Most guys will run out of balls before the Viper runs out of grip. Especially if you set it up a little towards neutral for track use, its a great performer.

 

[RedEnuf93]

It will let you drive right at the edge of its capabilities and then it will bite you without a warning...
The massive tires will provide endless grip, until its all over.

It is a great handling car, if you are used to it and can "read" the car (what it is telling to you while driving)

Corvettes are much more forgiving, they will also alert the driver earlier that you are entering into a "not so safe" driving zone. My truck will do that with simple tirenoise.

Only few have the real idea of the car's true capabilities, most of us have been punished by violent wheelspins, 180 degree donuts or hitting objects or ending upside down.

Didnt 5th GEAR call it: "It is as stupid and wonderful as an pet elephant..


WHAT A GREAT CAR!!! I LOVE IT!!!

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

I think some of this was due to the XGTZ tires on the Gen 1. It had much softer sidewalls than other tires and had a little "squirmy" feeling. Stuck until a sudden break-away, as has been noted by many. And legends are built on first impressions. The MXX3 was much stiffer, probably more typical, and therefore what people expected or are comfortable with. If you've ever had these two tires off the rim side by side you would really be surprised.

And OEM brake setup was pretty marginal, IMO...

 

[snampro]

Tom is probably right about the tires, but I think its mainly the fault of unskilled or reckless drivers.

 

[Asp Man]

I've thought long and hard about this one, the answer I came up with is jelousy.

These cars out-handle probably 99.25% of the cars out there. Maybe it was the xgtz's or the mxx3's that put the fear into some that it could bite you without warning. I've driven on mxx's and PS's and the difference, I've found, is quite litteraly night and day. I find that at the limit there is little warning with either, but that the PS's are easier to 'bring back', more forgiving (and look better, too).

To those who say the Viper won't handle, get a ride in one, and try not to leave fingernail impressions in the 'holy crap!' handle on the passenger door.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

That's it - the holy crap handle on the passenger door wasn't added until 1995.

 

[snampro]

I always thought it was funny to say, "yeah, this snake will bite you if you can't handle it"

 

[GotAViper]

Well let me put it this way.

My 1991 Z28 was all done up with near 355 hp and 405 tq.

I felt invincible in that thing. I could turn corners as fast as I want, do donuts, drift around turns, pretty much anything and I never felt like it was ever going to get away from me. I was ALWAYS 100% in control of it.

I have had the Viper for 2 years and I cant control the damn thing worth a crap. Given I havent had much time to drive it (maybe 2000 miles) but That thing gets away from me everytime i try to push it.

Now I have owned 5 camaros all the same year for 7 years so i figured i was probably so used to them that i knew every limit possible.

Maybe i just need to take the viper to the track and get used to it. I have spun out and lost control in the viper 3 times already in situations where my camaro would of handled with ease.

Maybe its the tq and hp difference. Maybe its me pushing the gas to hard when i shouldn't. I dont know to me it feels like it LOSES control too easy. and that can very much give the impression that it handles like crap.

I was doing a friendly race with my buddy's z06, we both hit it in second gear, he takes off and i quickly spin out. After the tires broke lose i let of the gas, but that wasnt enough... i had to counter steer about 10 times it just would NOT re-catch, where my camaro would 100% of the time. After attempting to catch it, the back end just very abruptly lost it and went sideways and i ended up sliding onto the other side of the road. I was very disapointed in the handling in this situation. It probably is the power difference, but i was battling with it for a good 10 seconds and could not get it under control.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

If those numbers were at the engine, your Camaro at the tires was ~ 300hp, 350tq. Gen 1 stock was 380/450? Your mods are worth 420/490 at the wheel? And you have a 3.55 rear, so you have perhap 60% more thrust available. If the rear is what you always lose first, then it is a right foot issue.

Give you fish: Kumho V700.
Learn to fish: autocross.

 

[GotAViper]

If those numbers were at the engine, your Camaro at the tires was ~ 300hp, 350tq. Gen 1 stock was 380/450? Your mods are worth 420/490 at the wheel? And you have a 3.55 rear, so you have perhap 60% more thrust available. If the rear is what you always lose first, then it is a right foot issue.

Give you fish: Kumho V700.
Learn to fish: autocross.

yeah it is def a big power difference between the 2, which is what i figure it is. But when the tires break lose int he camaro you can get it in control, and fast... in the viper - not so much. Once the tires go out in the viper even slightly it seems all over.

I just purchsed ccw 505 A wheels with the pirelli 355 tires (19") so my traction issues will probably only be worse now. I would like to get some autocross time to help me with my viper handling issues thou.

 

[AviP]

I never heard of this myth before. The Viper's always been the best handling car according to all the magazines and my personal street experience with rice, Vettes, Ferraris and Porsches. And to clarify, I am talking about lateral Gs and twisties, not just straight line performance.

 

[GotAViper]

Well if you haven't driven a viper before, it loses control very easily (at least the older gen 1's do to me.)

I still think it handles like crap, but I have zero track experience and not much seat time in my viper in general so i am optimistic that it will handle much better when i get to know it better. but for now... i liked my older camaro. haha

 

[Heysie]

What do you think the people at the other side of the ocean will be hearing all the time. In Europe most guys think that every American verhicle can only drive in a straight line, also a Viper.
I use my Viper a lot on trackdays (road racing) and drive often against porsches like 996 turbo and GT3, the porsches are known as superb handling cars, but they are (almost) as fast on the track as I am. Here's a pic of me chasing a 996 turbo. I was slighly faster but couldn't pass him.

You must be registered for see images attach

I only have Eibach springs, Stoptech brakes and Kumho's. I recently bought myself a BMW M3 3.2 (e36) for track use. Also the M3 is said to be a very good handling car. I took it to the track (bone stock) and it was a huge disapointment. The BMW is going to be stripped and prepped for the track with other suspension, brakes, rollbar, seats ,etc. Hoping to make it as good/fast as my Viper, but then it will not be a normal roadcar.

 

[Heysie]

Well if you haven't driven a viper before, it loses control very easily (at least the older gen 1's do to me.)

I still think it handles like crap, but I have zero track experience and not much seat time in my viper in general so i am optimistic that it will handle much better when i get to know it better. but for now... i liked my older camaro. haha

The "problem" of the Viper is, it have a very smal slip angle, when the car goes side ways it can't go to far or you will spin.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Heysie! "Only" brakes and Kumhos... agree 100%.

 

[troyrt10]

I believe the Viper is the most totalled exotic car. I think it's hard to control the Viper when accelerating. Especially for people like me that aren't extremely skilled track racers.

However, My GTS is a lot easier to handle than my Gen 1 RT/10 was.

I do think the brakes on the Gen 1 and 2 could be a lot better!!!JMO

 

[ACR steve]

I think the big problem is the cars ability is higher then the average viper owners ability.

 

[GTSnake]

I have to agree with the assessment that the Viper has a sharp drop off in controllability when you exceed the limits. It's not as forgiving as some other cars when you exceed those limits. Most cars will start to oversteer and squeal but the Viper just snap oversteer and end up in a spin. I guess the trick is just to learn the limits and not exceed them.

 

[OKViper]

Well if you haven't driven a viper before, it loses control very easily (at least the older gen 1's do to me.)

I still think it handles like crap, but I have zero track experience and not much seat time in my viper in general so i am optimistic that it will handle much better when i get to know it better. but for now... i liked my older camaro. haha

Sounds like you need to learn control, for yourself, not the car. The throttle is not an "on/off" switch. Your scenario of dropping to second to race a Z06 sounds like you made an error, and I find it hard to believe that you wrestled it for 10 seconds (maybe 1-2 seconds).
Either way, learn how to be responsible driving a big power car, or go back to that bitchin' camaro.

 

[Catwood]

You all need to get out and track your cars if you don't. The only way to learn is experience. Start slow and build up.

I'm an old man with old man reflexes and I can catch a heck of a lot of cars in the corners that are supposed to be great handling.

Is there enough power to overpower the rear tires...YES. And the street is not the place to practice the limits.

I love tracking this car...it makes me look better than I am....

 

[Heysie]

I love tracking this car...it makes me look better than I am....

That's what I like about tracking the Viper, if you go fast with it, then you know how to drive it!

 

[GotAViper]

Well if you haven't driven a viper before, it loses control very easily (at least the older gen 1's do to me.)

I still think it handles like crap, but I have zero track experience and not much seat time in my viper in general so i am optimistic that it will handle much better when i get to know it better. but for now... i liked my older camaro. haha

Sounds like you need to learn control, for yourself, not the car. The throttle is not an "on/off" switch. Your scenario of dropping to second to race a Z06 sounds like you made an error, and I find it hard to believe that you wrestled it for 10 seconds (maybe 1-2 seconds).
Either way, learn how to be responsible driving a big power car, or go back to that bitchin' camaro.

Well when i say dropping it into second i mean a 2nd gear pull, i hit the gas obviously too hard and rear end lost it (that was expected). what was not expected was when i let off the gas, for the rear end to be swiviling around like on ice. And when i say 10 seconds your right, a bit elaborated.. but the i counter steered 6 times, how many times do u lose control and need to counter steer 6 freakin times? the rear end would just not re-catch like i mentioned the feeling was on ice. i wasn't jerking it, i was littly wrestling it to keep it steady until it would re-grip and then...

out of completely nowhere, the car just took off sideways... and it was over.

My friends in viper behind me said it was completely odd looking. they could see that the rear end was spinning, and they could see me fighting it , they said it was just barely swerving left to right, back and forth and then it just jolted completely left. I felt like i had no control.

In the camaro (i know not a great comparison) In a situation where the rear end breaks lose, you counter steer once or twice and you feel it trying to re-grip and then it does. It doesn't just fly around on you.

I have had this happen to me 3 times, not just once which is why i get the impression the handling *****. The camaro I had ran was a high 12 second car so its power is not the same but somewhat close and it was always very forgiving. I tore that damn car up and much as anyone could tear a car up. I could be in a turn and floor it in 1st gear and feel like i have more control then i do in my viper hitting the gas in a turn.

 

[Asp Man]

"Here's a pic of me chasing a 996 turbo. I was slighly faster but couldn't pass him."


That is good to hear, Heysie, stock genI vs 996 being a close match on the track. These are the kind of facts that should be spread around!!

 

[Heysie]

what was not expected was when i let off the gas, for the rear end to be swiviling around like on ice.



In the camaro (i know not a great comparison) In a situation where the rear end breaks lose, you counter steer once or twice and you feel it trying to re-grip and then it does. It doesn't just fly around on you.

Was your Camaro an automatic?
The engine from the Viper will work like an ebrake when you let of the gas, so when your car is slipping and then let off the gas, it will be difficult to control the car.

 

[AviP]

I think the big problem is the cars ability is higher then the average viper owners ability.

ACR Steve hit it on the head. There is no way to drive this car to it's limit on the street. Doing so WILL inevitably cause an accident and creates the "bad handling" myth.

 

[Early93Viper]

Wow I wasn't really expecting this myth to be so alive among viper owners. Most everyone that has been on a track with a viper (that I know) praises its handling.

When I am on the track I can easily "catch" the car if it goes into a small slide. Now I wouldn't let her slide so far out I start drifting. (There's no reason for that) But small slides are pretty controllable. Especially once I put the Kumhos on.