sad news...viper plant shuttered until end June.

[Bobpantax]

Quite a few of us did not "overpay" under any definition of that term. And if you count the value of the longer enjoyment early purchasers got, even if they paid more, I doubt that many feel that it was not worth it.

If the Viper does not survive, those of us who put our money where are mouth or key strokes were/are will have what I predict will be a very collectable car.

Every "professional" evaluation of the TA has raved about it. Everyone who has bought one who has reported back to this Forum loves the car. I feel sorry for the naysayers. They are missing out on something very, very special.

Bob your right as i cant run over to Buhler and in about 5 min take ANY GEN 5 he has out .Please those on this forum that OVERPAID for the GEN 5 will say anything to try to preserve some sort of resale value on their cars.The fact of the matter is this if they want to keep the model alive the only way to do so is drop the price to a point indictive of what the compet is offering .When a propective buyer can go out and buy a low mileage Ferrarri 430 or FGT at thousands less than a new Dodge theres a sales problem for the Dodge

 

[VRYALT3R3D]

VRYALT3R3D: I never said the local dealer would not warrant the vehicle. You simply get better service and preferential treatment when you buy the car where you service it. I did talk to the sales manager directly at my local dealer and spent half hour going over my concern (service quality, availability of Viper Tech, etc) and he gave me a tour of the back shop). I also called 4 dealers around and asked to talk to the manager about the Viper. 2 of them never called back and 2 of them told me that they would not let people drive the car.

That *****. If that happened to me, I probably wouldn't buy a Viper either. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[09 Venom]

From what I've seen, the Gen V just floors people with its looks. But, like your experience, the higher end demographics that Dodge is going after is NOT buying the Gen V. They may ooh and ahh about it, but WHY is it that they're not biting? Why did that Panamera Turbo owner bypass the Viper when he admires it so much? Those people have plenty of disosable $. The Gen V was not catered to the working man Viper enthusiast (I feel that Dodge overlooked them and took them for granted).

Good question. I don't have the answer. Maybe people still have the opinion that the Viper is a brutal beast. Until the 'potential' buyers can test drive one they will never know how awesome the car really is.

 

[09 Venom]

09Venom: again those are lame excuses, when the first Viper came out, it was a hit because it kicked b&&t everywhere. Now all the forum says is that it is a track star. That is my point. if SRT wants to sell more cars ie not shut down for a month which is the point of the OP, it has to be a star on the road and compete in straight line performance and everyday driving.
VRYALT3R3D: I never said the local dealer would not warrant the vehicle. You simply get better service and preferential treatment when you buy the car where you service it. I did talk to the sales manager directly at my local dealer and spent half hour going over my concern (service quality, availability of Viper Tech, etc) and he gave me a tour of the back shop). I also called 4 dealers around and asked to talk to the manager about the Viper. 2 of them never called back and 2 of them told me that they would not let people drive the car.

I know of only a handful of cars that can trap 129mph in the 1/4 mile stock. It does have the straight line performance.

 

[Free2go]

I gotta say the Black T/A made my balls tingle when I saw it for the first time. But you Gen V owners really need to shut the hell up when somebody decides to critique some aspect of some model of the car. Your defensiveness just screeeeeaaaams to be trolled. To me, it seems the car is not REALLY the reason your defensive. It looks to me like a few people at the top of the VCA and the VOA are still in a ******* match over who can get the SRT coddling and "soft money". SRT would have to be STUPID to choose one or the other. Now, with that being said, I'd like to see the Gen V owners just fess up and admit they basically bought a Gen 2 tribute car. I have a Gen 2 car so ipso facto I should not be talked down to when criticizing your "unmodifiable clone" car with Alcantra leather seats and GPS.

 

[Bobpantax]

I have got to admit that the above is pretty funny. A black and tan toast to you.

 

[cubican]

More bad news looks like SRT just pulled out of the 24hr race in France .

 

[Free2go]

One thing I just have to know about the Gen V and I don't think it's been asked to my knowledge: Does it have a plastic power steering pulley and a power steering pump mounting bracket made out of pottery?

 

[VENOM V]

I gotta say the Black T/A made my balls tingle when I saw it for the first time. But you Gen V owners really need to shut the hell up when somebody decides to critique some aspect of some model of the car. Your defensiveness just screeeeeaaaams to be trolled. To me, it seems the car is not REALLY the reason your defensive. It looks to me like a few people at the top of the VCA and the VOA are still in a ******* match over who can get the SRT coddling and "soft money". SRT would have to be STUPID to choose one or the other. Now, with that being said, I'd like to see the Gen V owners just fess up and admit they basically bought a Gen 2 tribute car. I have a Gen 2 car so ipso facto I should not be talked down to when criticizing your "unmodifiable clone" car with Alcantra leather seats and GPS.

LOL, if you want to sit at the big boy table you have to earn respect of your fellow Viper owners. Until then, please put this dunce cap on and go sit in the corner.

 

[VENOM V]

One thing I just have to know about the Gen V and I don't think it's been asked to my knowledge: Does it have a plastic power steering pulley and a power steering pump mounting bracket made out of pottery?

Krate, is that you?

 

[Free2go]

Haha! I'll wear the dunce cap. And trust me...I'm not Krate, the pontificating perverted pudgy purveyor of perpetry.

 

[SnakeBitten]

More bad news looks like SRT just pulled out of the 24hr race in France .

Wow if true. This really disappoints me and says a lot in conjunction with the plant closing. I guess if you can't sell on Monday, then racing on Sunday will be a no go especially given the Vipers comparatively meager budget and poor sales. It appears it may not be able to sustain its existence. I don't like where this "looks" like it's going.

Just found the link in Autoweek:
http://www.autoweek.com/article/20140324/UNITEDSPORTSCAR/140329918

Heres and interesting quote from the article:

"When asked Monday evening by Autoweek if skipping Le Mans is a result of low Viper road-car sales and the recent shutdown at Detroit’s Conner Ave. Plant where the cars are built, an SRT source said, “No, motorsports and product strategy are two separate business functions.”

I have read that the Viper road car and racing program are part of the Vipers budget. If so wouldn't the racing be affected as well by the poor sales?

At least it still will run Tudor stateside so I may be a bit premature in my above outlook. Its hard to imagine its not budget related as to why they are not making the expensive commitment to Le Mans this year. They are competitive so why else would they not run the car there?

 

[KB Viper]

That's crazy. I'm a business man and when sales are down you don't stop prospecting for new biz you go harder. They should be entering more events not pulling out and they should be doing more advertising. When people are on the fence about buying the new Viper and they are in research mode the need to see that the brand thriving not pulling out of events and shutting down plants. Nobody new to the brand will like that type of uncertainty. Did they really expect that after a three hiatus that once they debuted the new Viper that sales would immediately be over 2k a year? I thought the combined company of Fiat and Chrysler would have the resources to market the hell out of the Viper?

 

[Bruce H.]

I think lots of uncertainty was already there. Hoping and expecting that Ralph has something up his sleeve that will be a much more significant game-changer.

 

[Nsane1]

I am hopeful there is something in the works, and have heard rumors of same. I can't tell you how many times I get "it's a shame they don't make Vipers any longer" to which I have to always correct them. Admittedly, these usually aren't a prospective buyer (usually a gas station attendant), but if CAR guys, no matter the income, don't know this car exists, do we think the "rich" with no time on their hands, and a crowded market, even know about this car without some time to be actually out in the market?

I think, however, we are over-emphasizing the import of the race in France. If they pull out of Daytona 24, that's a big deal. The Europeans can't even buy a gen 5 (normally), so I think from a business standpoint, the extra cost of running that race is not going to fly with the extra scrutiny. Don't get me wrong, it *****, but if you cut back, that's where I'd cut first.

So we don't run France, but we get podium finishes in all the Tudor races and spank vette at each one, I think maybe people will start to notice that, and then blam, an ACR or some kind of killer car is announced that takes the true DNA of the race car (that just won all these races), from the savings on the France race, I think that might be a compelling story.

Hopefully there is a silver lining...

 

[SnakeBitten]

Maybe the money saved from the plant shutdown and them not going to Le Mans can go into the street car in the form of an added vert or ACR and/or upgrades?

 

[SylvanSRT]

well if the Le Mans race is out.....i guess that blows the idea of the coupe first for racing in terms of intoducing the new model as a coupe first. either just coincidence or economics, just in IMHO the drop top should have come first in the gen V as it has w/ every other gerneration. supporting the what i read earlier that the majority of all vipers are drop tops, why wouldnt you go for the larger sales volume if you are trying to save a model/brand/nameplate??

 

[v10viperbox]

Now that you can find new SRTs in the $85,000 range

I have yet to see one at that price and I have been looking.

Couple things keeping me from upgrading.

The dealership experience is terrible locally.
There are no special finance rates available which is painful when say Audi will do 0.9% on a used R8.
They keep making more and more TA's. I wanted a TA they said that it was going to be a limited model and now there are tons of them out there. I bet that a orange TA is now the most common color other then the launch editions.

 

[Bruce H.]

They keep making more and more TA's. I wanted a TA they said that it was going to be a limited model and now there are tons of them out there. I bet that a orange TA is now the most common color other then the launch editions.

Just 33 black, 33 white, and 93 orange...that's total for all markets, so less for U.S. After 150 LE blue there were 100 red SRT with Track Pack, IRC, and whatever other red SRT and GTS got ordered. Not sure how popular other colours have been.

 

[VENOM V]

I have yet to see one at that price and I have been looking.

Couple things keeping me from upgrading.

The dealership experience is terrible locally.
There are no special finance rates available which is painful when say Audi will do 0.9% on a used R8.
They keep making more and more TA's. I wanted a TA they said that it was going to be a limited model and now there are tons of them out there. I bet that a orange TA is now the most common color other then the launch editions.

I've heard that they may have made as many as 53 Stryker Reds, LOL. But let me tell you, everywhere I drive it, people are just blown away by the color. Not to mention the Halle Berry curves. And when you drive it on the track, people just can't believe their eyes. The Orange TA with the black wheels and carbon everywhere has the same effect, it's truly one of the most special looking Vipers made. I would not consider either color common, I would consider them among the best of all time, destined to be classic. Up there with Snake Skin Green, those are my top 3. IMHO, of course. Opinions will vary. Hard to find a color I don't love on the Viper, to be honest. Nearly bought a black one before I got my Stryker.

If you want one of the best dealers, hands-down, Normandin in San Jose. Paul Normandin is a Viper guy to the core, he's owned a Viper far longer than he's been a dealer. He's active with the local Viper club, he just raced in 25 Hours of Thunderhill in a Panoz. The experience has been exceptional, including service. He has an Orange TA in stock as well as some other sweet Vipers, including an Anodized Carbon on the way. Drive up north and pick up your new snake.

 

[habeb]

If you want one of the best dealers, hands-down, Normandin in San Jose. Paul Normandin is a Viper guy to the core, he's owned a Viper far longer than he's been a dealer. He's active with the local Viper club, he just raced in 25 Hours of Thunderhill in a Panoz. The experience has been exceptional, including service. He has an Orange TA in stock as well as some other sweet Vipers, including an Anodized Carbon on the way. Drive up north and pick up your new snake.

Wonder if it's still there, their website no longer list the car.

As for dealer experience, stopped by a few weeks back on a Saturday to look at the Orange TA. Wanted to side inside, but doors were locked and the person who had the key was not in. The salesperson asked me to wait with no definitive time. Sure I should have made an appointment, but happen to be in the area.

 

[emericr]

And those handful of cars are selling very well, manufacturer not closing the plant or not cancelling on racing events (GTR, 458, Aventador, MP12, P997TT, ZR-1). I never stated that it does not have the straight line performance, it just does not have the superiority it used to have with the Gen I (it was .4 sec seconds faster than the fastest bull the diablo)
20 years ago, if you wanted supercar performance, your choices were fairly limited: Ferrari, Lambo, Porsche TT (to name the most widely sold). Technology has evolved so much that you can now have the best of both worlds and be very close in performance without spending the farm and the Viper's competition has increased ie the low end of the $$ spectrum (Corvette Z06, ZR1, Mustang GT-500, GTR, Jaguar F type, and even Audi R8 or McLaren in the mid 100s).
You add to that the poor marketing and the useless dealers which brings us to today...

I know of only a handful of cars that can trap 129mph in the 1/4 mile stock. It does have the straight line performance.

 

[Free2go]

I don't know of too much advertising or marketing relating to any of the high end sports cars. The cars sell themselves. If they kick butt in the auto mags or at the track they create buzz and people start chirping. There are guys on this site who have lots of money and have been faithfully purchasing Vipers for many years. They are the Viper "elite" and have my respect. But these guys, (and it frosts my nuts) instead of being pissed at Fiat for not creating an affordable world ****** (which could have been possible in the platform), they are screaming about how awesome the car is and how we should all run down and get one. This is America people. The Viper should dominate. Good luck getting Fiat to build a dominant "American" super car.

 

[Bobpantax]

The Gen V was engineered and designed with a significant amount of input from VCA members. Chrysler filed for bankruptcy in 2009. The Viper line was for sale during the bankruptcy and a number of potential deals fell through. The Viper was dead and the last Gen IV which, at that time, was going to be the last Viper, rolled off the line on July 1, 2010. ( I was there for that event.)

Through a small miracle involving the passion of Ralph Gilles and a few loyal people who stuck around Chrysler during the bankruptcy and some ardent VCA members who even went so far as to produce a video about the Viper, the Gen V was saved when Fiat had just taken over and had minimal cash to spend. It was a very gutsy move at the time.

Now we have a bunch of keyboard jockies who clearly do not know the history of the Gen V and who do not realize that part of the problem being discussed was/is caused by what can be seen as a failure of the VCA's and the other club's members to follow through and buy the car that they said that they wanted.


Ralph gave us a great car. The marketing errors that occurred have nothing to do with the actual car. It is time for all of the people who were/are so allegedly passionate about the Viper to step up to the plate and buy the car. Any other response is just pure BS.

 

[bushido]

. Good luck getting Fiat to build a dominant "American" super car.

Chrysler has always been on tough times. A company that has been part owned by 2 companies. Daimler Benz, Cerberus and now FIAT owns 100% percent. Do these companies that have owned part of Chrysler care about the Viper? I bet FIAT is more focused on spending their money on how to sell more Abarths. How can we get Americans to like FIAT cars..
I wonder how much FIAT paid P Diddy on the FIAT 500L commercial..

The Viper Racing program is also like Grass Roots Racing compared to Toyota's Racing Development, or even GM's. Which has test facilities racing experience in Europe ,and all over the world..

FIAT already has a Halo car ( Ferraris). IMO Chrysler for them is strictly business. FIAT has been trying a very long time getting a foot in the American market..

Besides GM's halo car the Corvette.. Heres what they can do with the resources, development they got,and when a car company isn't owned by another, or an "outsider"..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqkyWhVBSKU

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[JohnnyLightning]

If anyone who read my notes over the past 6 to 8 months I have been negative about the Gen V for many reasons. It was flawed from the beginning. It lacks from performace to refinement for a 152k car for todays standards compared to past Vipers. When there is a car that has a variance of 102k to 152k with no real performace difference but just some leather and cheap plastic pieces still on the hood they have a problem. I own a Gen II GTS B/W and proud to drive it since many will agree its the best looking. In no way did anyone bring the Gen II looks back especially from the front. The first time I saw the Gen V it reminded me of the Mazda 3 that smiles at you. The Gen II looks likes its about to tear you a new one. The 08 to 10 ACRs has the same stance but the Gen V looks like it about to kiss you from rear view mirror. If you think 152k price tag is a bargain you might want to look under the skin of this car because most of the components are outdated compared to competitors for around same price tag. I know Fiat put a budget and we should be lucky but I disagree with that. If they wanted to bring it back then do it right not halfway. I know of handful potential Gen V owners whom now holding onto to their cash for the new Z06 since I don't blame them. If someone wants to get in an argument we pay for exclusive purposes then why does a fully loaded GTS Viper cost more than a R8 V10? Those cars have been selling like hot cakes but Gen V sits on showroom floors. I am for killing this Viper off and saving what dignity we have but as I tell many friends the Viper died when Dodge was removed. When it was a Dodge at least the plastic still meant we are going to rip you a new. Oh by the way as you know Gen II Vipers have been going up in price as Gen V are depreciating like an Aston Martin and in no ways will the Gen V be a collectors item in any near term since no kid has a poster of a Gen V on his wall dreaming of owning one like there were in the 90s.

 

[Bobpantax]

Have you driven one Johnny? Have you closley inspected one? I doubt it based on your post. The TA, especially in black, is a mean looking piece.

The Gen II was a great car. But compared to the Gen V it is primitive, kit carish, and does not have anywhere near the stock performance in a straight line or otherwise of the Gen V.

Did I love my Roe supercharged Gen II at the time? Yes. But the car did not, and does not hold a candle to my TA. The TA is a whole different level of car that has little in common with the Gen II except a few design cues, a ten cylinder engine and a six speed manual transmission. Furthermore, if you adjust the price I paid for my 1999 GTS for inflation, I only paid a bit more for my TA - a bargain since it has far more content with far better performance and perfect fit and finish.

As for the Audi R8, it is a poser's car. And I think you know that.

The most inaccurate part of your post above is your statement regarding refinement. The Gen V is as refined as any car in its price range or costing a multiple of its price.

 

[Free2go]

Bob, in response to your last paragraph in post 174. You can have crappy marketing and a great car, you can have great marketing and a crappy car. We all know that marketing has nothing to do with the actual car. And Bob, your equating "true passion" with the purchase of a Gen V. Am I less passionate if I bought another Gen 2?

 

[Paul Hawker]

Listen guys. No need to justify the purchase of the Viper you have in your garage. It's your money, and everybody gets to spend it in the way you wish.

All Vipers, since the very first ones, share the same Viper DNA. Same big v-10, same manual 6 speed, same huge tires, same 2 seat interior. I remember the Gen I vs. Gen II wars. The Coupe vs. RT/10 wars. The Coupe vs. Vert wars. The my color car is the fastest wars. Kind of harmless forum banter, but some people take it personally when someone else questions another owners choice. Kind of like someone telling you that your kid looks funny. Most get a little offended if someone tells them that their kid is so much better looking.

If you take the cost out of it, and a bunch of free Vipers were on a lot, and you were able to take anyone of them home, most (but certaintly not all) would pick the newest model with the most horsepower, or best handling. Since in reality, you can't take the cost out of it, please let everyone take home the one that best fits their pocketbook.

So if everyone would just enjoy the Viper (if you are so lucky) in their own garage, and not worry so much about what someone else has in their garage...please.

 

[Bobpantax]

Bob, in response to your last paragraph in post 174. You can have crappy marketing and a great car, you can have great marketing and a crappy car. We all know that marketing has nothing to do with the actual car. And Bob, your equating "true passion" with the purchase of a Gen V. Am I less passionate if I bought another Gen 2?

No. But if one is passionate about Vipers as opposed to their particular Viper, they would care enough about the continued existence of the Viper to not bash the Gen V without ever having driven it enough to experience its potential and closely inspecting it.

There are a number of cars I like that I would never buy based on price but I would not bash them because of that. How much money someone is willing to spend on a car is a personal choice and really has nothing to do with whether the price is too high or the quality of the car. It has to do with how much money they have or their particular value sytem even if they have the money. As an example, I think the big Rolls Royce is an incredible car but my internal programming would never let me spend that kind of bread for a car.

What I see happening on this forum too frequently is posters bashing the car instead of just saying: "Beautiful car. I wish I had the coin to buy one." Some do say that and they are stand up people who I admire for their honesty.