Is a viper with navigation really a viper???

[sween]

Does anyone else think having navigation as an option for the 2008 viper makes it less viperish. I thought vipers should be raw and unluxurious as can be thats why theres not any cup holders or anything like that. Does anyone get what im saying or with 600 hp they could care less if it comes with navigation .

 

[black mamba1]

are you serious?

 

[bluestreak]

I see where you're coming from, but navi doesnt make it any less of a viper. Creature comforts sell cars my friend.

 

[Flyntgr]

I have a navigation unit which plugs into outlet, but it would be easier if it were built-in. Cruise control might not be for everyone, but on trips of hundreds of miles (yes, I do DRIVE my Vipers) it is necessary for this old 60+ body. Or isn't a grandpa entitled to love driving his SRT Viper? Neither the Nav nor the cruise makes it less than a Viper....

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Creature comforts sell cars my friend.

So does fuel economy and back seats.

Yes Sween, navigation makes it less Viper. So does cup holders, TPS, ABS, poser wheel dimensions, etc. Thankfully the 08 is still retaining Viper status with record setting power numbers, but nothing lasts forever.

 

[rcl4668]

Interesting question.

I ordered navigation on my 2008 for two reasons. First, I actually think it will be more useful than the six-disc changer in my 2006. Because of the sound and volume of the Viper, especially in the roadster, I usually preferred to listen to the car instead of the radio. In fact, I think I used the stereo on the 06 less than 10 times. On the other hand, I liked checking out new/favorite roads in the Viper and I think having the nav will be more useful in terms of not getting lost or finding local points of interest.

Second, I think the Nav faceplate is much cleaner and is a great improvement over the standard six-disc changer faceplate. The downside of course is that when you have Nav operating you can't play CDs and even when you can you only have a single CD slot.

So, to answer your question, no I don't think it makes it less of a Viper, just the opposite: The nav encourages and makes the act of driving and exploring new roads easier while making it harder or less desireable to listen to music. That's what the Viper is about.

/Rich

 

[SylvanSRT]

BTW sween SRT-10's have a cup/can holder. I also would like to have th radio controls on the steering wheel(if it was a matter of only adding a few ounces or minimal weight)

 

[dave6666]

I ordered my '08 with the optional dishwasher and blender for tailgating. The retractable grill works nicely too, but like all Vipers, the cabin heat makes the mini fridge a little weak. Does all this make my car less of a Viper? You bet it does. Darn thing looks a Memorial Day appliance sale at Circuit City.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Darn thing looks a Memorial Day appliance sale at Circuit City.

Or a GM lot.

 

[Nader]

Changing the radio makes it less a Viper? The NAV radio makes a world of difference compared to the stock one that comes in every other Chrsler car. It looks 1000% better, sounds better, and is useful on long trips.

 

[rcl4668]

Changing the radio makes it less a Viper? The NAV radio makes a world of difference compared to the stock one that comes in every other Chrsler car. It looks 1000% better, sounds better, and is useful on long trips.

Nader --

Just curious, what do you mean by it sounding better? Thanks.

/Rich

 

[ulllose]

just bought one on ebay the other day for 500.00. I can not wait to put it in, my stock rbq or whatever it is really *****, reception is horrible. (maybe it was just my unit)

 

[wallbanger]

Aftermarket rims make it less of a viper

 

[black mamba1]

Aftermarket rims make it less of a viper

I personally HATE aftermarket rims. I know there are some practical reasons to go aftermarket rims for weight savings or to accomodate stickier tires, but many people overlook that the rims are designed to aid in brake cooling and in pulling air from under the car to reduce lift. In addition, the suspension is set for rims of a paticular weight and rotational mass. Simply throwing aftermarket rims on a 200 mph car capable of pulling over a g in a turn is INSANE to me.

But, I did add Nav to my Viper, hell, I got tired of getting lost going on these backwood cruises and to these tracks out in the middle of no-where and ending up at Neds tobacco-spittin' contest range instead of Limerock raceway....

Nav is cool, but race logic is for the Vette-hearted. However I will say that the one thing that kept me from buying a Viper was lack of ABS when they first came out...I thought it diabolic to make a car w/ amost 500 hp and no abs....but of course that has been addresed.

 

[dave6666]

Aftermarket rims make it less of a viper

Well said. I know I am the minority more than likely, as it seems everyone wants to change wheels immediately after acquiring the car - 1st mod - but I think the designers do a swell job spec'ing wheels. I will never change the wheels on my '01 GTS just for the looks factor.

My opinion, and it'll be the same next week.

 

[Nader]

Nader --

Just curious, what do you mean by it sounding better? Thanks.

/Rich

I mean that I think the radio simply sounds better then the stock one. Maybe better quality as it is made by Alpine.

 

[Nader]

I personally HATE aftermarket rims. I know there are some practical reasons to go aftermarket rims for weight savings or to accomodate stickier tires, but many people overlook that the rims are designed to aid in brake cooling and in pulling air from under the car to reduce lift. In addition, the suspension is set for rims of a paticular weight and rotational mass. Simply throwing aftermarket rims on a 200 mph car capable of pulling over a g in a turn is INSANE to me.

But, I did add Nav to my Viper, hell, I got tired of getting lost going on these backwood cruises and to these tracks out in the middle of no-where and ending up at Neds tobacco-spittin' contest range instead of Limerock raceway....

Nav is cool, but race logic is for the Vette-hearted. However I will say that the one thing that kept me from buying a Viper was lack of ABS when they first came out...I thought it diabolic to make a car w/ amost 500 hp and no abs....but of course that has been addresed.

I can assure that if you did drive a car with a lighter rim and tire package you would have a different opinion. The stock package is overweight and the tires are too hard or rigid.

As for brake cooling no issue here and I have run on several tracks and the lift issue is a non issue...

As for the engineers designing the rims... they were designed for heavy, run flat tires so they needed to be extremely Stong "heavy" to deal with the rigors of running flat.

In the end i wouldnt do a modification which does provide a benefit or overall improvement of the working of the car. The HREs are probably 8-15 lighter at each corner which results in an immediate, noticeable improvement in ride and handling.

 

[bluestreak]

So does fuel economy and back seats.

Yes Sween, navigation makes it less Viper. So does cup holders, TPS, ABS, poser wheel dimensions, etc. Thankfully the 08 is still retaining Viper status with record setting power numbers, but nothing lasts forever.

Maybe some people could use that traction control or vipers wouldnt have such a bad reputation at the track. The patented word on the side of the car makes it a viper, you dont remove the R because it has a navigation.

You can stay in the stone age with your beleifs but dodge ate it enough with the first iteration of the SRT-10 that they have wised up a little bit, thank goodness you dont work for them.

 

[Vipermann]

I can tell that the RB4 I put in my '05 saved my butt several times while driving to Vegas last September. The NAV is really a great tool for scenic road trips.

 

[wallbanger]

They had vipers in the stone age? What were we eating with the first iteration of the srt10? Well whatever it was it tasted good

 

[bluestreak]

They had vipers in the stone age? What were we eating with the first iteration of the srt10? Well whatever it was it tasted good

profits for dodge were being eaten.

Yeah stone age, lets put 600 hp in a car and not have any electronic aids for some of the worst drivers in the world (americans), it was barely cool w/ 400 hp. Now it is not cool.

 

[wallbanger]

So cars without traction control should be limited to non-Americans? And profits by a large american corportation were being eaten - so unamerican.

 

[bluestreak]

So cars without traction control should be limited to non-Americans? And profits by a large american corportation were being eaten - so unamerican.

500 and 600 hp cars w/out tc should be limited to pro drivers, but of course the edginess feeds the ego. Lets go through the list of cars in the same production number range as the viper w/ as much hp/torque and no tc......................... I cant think of any, can you???


But of course us cocky americans like to beat our chest and say "I dont need no tc". The viper is a great car, but far from a handling marvel, good ole bute force to make a fast lap, or run a fast quarter, so yeah, tc would make it a wuss car.......

 

[wallbanger]

i have traction control(TC) on my srt8 jeep and even tho it is AWD the TC is useful on sharp turns in wet conditions as it prevents the rear end from fishtailing out but in dry conditions it ***** and pretty much takes over the car.

As an american who owns a corportation and has eaten the profits for many years i am glad i have the choice of a 600hp car without TC..It is not about being a wuss car it is about the driver being in control . Sure with TC u just kinda sit there and let the computer take over...i may as well mess with my navigation system if i have the TC on cos i sure don't need my eyes on the road/track

Also i don't think it takes a lot of time or training to become a decent driver ... i hate to say i watch "hogan knows best" but in a recent episode he (hogan) took just one lesson and vastly improved his skills. i think i'm gonna catch some flack for this hogan reference

I suppose one could put TC on the viper with the option of turning it off like other cars. Driving a car with the TC on is like sex with a ****** - u'll never really get to feel/know the inside of the car

 

[bluestreak]

i have traction control(TC) on my srt8 jeep and even tho it is AWD the TC is useful on sharp turns in wet conditions as it prevents the rear end from fishtailing out but in dry conditions it ***** and pretty much takes over the car.

As an american who owns a corportation and has eaten the profits for many years i am glad i have the choice of a 600hp car without TC..It is not about being a wuss car it is about the driver being in control . Sure with TC u just kinda sit there and let the computer take over...i may as well mess with my navigation system if i have the TC on cos i sure don't need my eyes on the road/track

Also i don't think it takes a lot of time or training to become a decent driver ... i hate to say i watch "hogan knows best" but in a recent episode he (hogan) took just one lesson and vastly improved his skills. i think i'm gonna catch some flack for this hogan reference

I suppose one could put TC on the viper with the option of turning it off like other cars. Driving a car with the TC on is like sex with a ****** - u'll never really get to feel/know the inside of the car

Your SRT-8 isnt even remotely in the same ballpark, try driving a 600 hp car with no TC at the limit, and one driving lesson will NOT get you there. As you move up you get tires that dont tell you when you're letting go, they just go, you have to be prepared for that and it takes time SEAT TIME (if you have read or heard anything about road racing you'll know what I'm talking about). You have to have lightning quick, precise reactions because over reacting puts you in a worse situation.

My point is simply that for all these people beating their chest saying it wont be a viper w/ traction control, most of them cant drive worth a crap and many are responsible for the notorious reputation the viper has on the track. TC would be a benefit to this car, especially for people who end up on the track for the first time and they are in a viper. And no abs would be absolutely assinine!!

There just isnt enough emphasis on driving skill in this country to have people running around in these carzy hp cars without TC, of course once you are comfy driving at the limit you cant wait to turn it off. But I gaurantee you 90% of viper owners are not at that level and when they get into a hairy situation, BAMM!!!!!!


For Example: Road Atlanta Nasa Driving event two weeks ago, a guy shows up in a GTS with FULL racing slicks (non DOT) that has 600 hp (hennessey 600) AND ITS HIS FIRST TIME EVER ON A TRACK ------>>>> AT ROAD ATLANTA!!!!! RA eats cars like nobodies business, and I have personally watched two guys in SRT-10's make fools of themselves track day after track day until one put his car into the wall where I have never seen a car hit the wall before (the other has a vid on the net look up VIPER IDIOT).


Even seasoned Road Racers would be nervous pushing this car to the max, so Joe Blow really doesnt have much chance to learn and grow slowly by using the TC to determine the best lines for the car (many drivers use TC to test their lines, if your TC isnt coming on, you are in the cars comfort zone and still can be faster) but simply go running out like they are former F1 champions, and it's not just vipers, but all kinds of cars. My point is simply at this point the Viper should have TC.

 

[wallbanger]

i agree with u're last post .. tc and ESP are superior to human performance because depending on the particular driving situation, the system may activate an individual wheel brake or any combination of the four, as well as control the throttle, until the vehicle is once again stable. It is the esp that works on the lateral (side to side) axis. I think dodge offers the esp on the caliber r/t for just $250.

 

[Nader]

Whether someone is able to take the Viper to its limit without traction control is not the point. The car was built for a niche audience who are purists. If someone is interested in traction control and a more refined car, it certainly is not the Viper. Would traction control be a benefit in some circumstances - sure but I along with most are not interested. Thanks.

 

[bluestreak]

Whether someone is able to take the Viper to its limit without traction control is not the point. The car was built for a niche audience who are purists. If someone is interested in traction control and a more refined car, it certainly is not the Viper. Would traction control be a benefit in some circumstances - sure but I along with most are not interested. Thanks.

That is garbage, you telling me you wouldnt buy the latest iteration of the viper if it looked better, handled better was faster and the only difference was TC? And I bet you pitched a fit when ABS was added too didnt you? Nevertheless it's on the car, and you have an SRT. It's called evolution. What defines a purist, and at what power level will you concede this nonsense, 700 hp, 800 hp? And driving the car as it's limit doesnt have to be intentional. Ignorance and pride are the worst thing you can have in a car with 600 hp.

 

[sween]

. Lets go through the list of cars in the same production number range as the viper w/ as much hp/torque and no tc......................... I cant think of any, can you???

thats why a viper is like no other car on the road

 

[Nader]

That is garbage, you telling me you wouldnt buy the latest iteration of the viper if it looked better, handled better was faster and the only difference was TC? And I bet you pitched a fit when ABS was added too didnt you? Nevertheless it's on the car, and you have an SRT. It's called evolution. What defines a purist, and at what power level will you concede this nonsense, 700 hp, 800 hp? And driving the car as it's limit doesnt have to be intentional. Ignorance and pride are the worst thing you can have in a car with 600 hp.

I never said I wouldnt buy a new Viper if it, along with other improvements, came with traction control. My first experience with the Viper is my 2004 so I wasnt an enthusiast before that. If the Viper evolution went down that road I would certainly consider it but that is getting off topic. You call it nonsense but I call it owning a car like no other. It is a niche car for a niche market. I have owned several other sports cars including Porsches and BMWs. While they are great cars, nothing matchs the personality and over-the-edge design of the Viper. Everytime I get in and press the start button, it brings a smile my face. Someone recently said it best here, the Viper is a race car developed for the street instead of a street car built with the track in mind.

Again the car isnt for everyone and all of us have heard of horrible stories of those who dont respect the car. But then again that happens to most high horsepower cars, with and without traction control.